Shifter Engine Classification

[Nathan B]

Just wanted to get the conversation started on this, as we have a pretty diverse group of karts running in the class and thought we could consider some measures to even up the different HP of each engine class. Don't want to see guys bailing out of the class if they don't think they have the equipment to compete.

The stock moto is generally in the 35hp range.

ICC engines like the TM K9/10 , IAME X30, Vortex, Pavesi ect... are typically in the 40-45 hp range.

Then there are the Modified Motos which are approaching ICC levels of power or more if you go crazy.


I think our min weight right now is 385. I think a reasonable proposal would be to require any ICC/Mod Moto to weigh in at 395 and a stock moto min weight of 375 ?

I don't think any solution that has ICC guys strapping a ton of lead to their kart is the right one, I would think the Moto guys would need to find ways to lighten their package?


Any other thoughts or ideas? It will be next to impossible to regulate, and we don't want to be tech'n or DQ'n at races because guys miss it by a pound, or have a silencer that not part of the SKUSA stock moto pacakge. But so far the class is pretty open and following a gentlemans set of rules, just wanted to see if this was a concern or not.

[phil]

We got Alan out in the OLD Renspeed last Saturday. It has a Yamaha Moto on it & I have no idea what it has for HP. I do know we weighed it and he was at 420lb, so I think we would be good to go.

[Mark]

I have yet to weigh my shifter so I don't know how it'd pan out for me but I'm a featherweight so I would think it'd be ok with my moto.

[Gerhard8020]

This is a great idea! In a DD2 I'm 415 lbs, for me it is pointless going to races in the open shifter class.

I intend acquiring an ICC shifter very soon, unfortunately the extra power will not make enough difference if the minimum is 385. A 396 lbs minimum also aligns with the DD2 Masters class weight.

[Joey Guyon]

Sounds like just
Hillier and myself can make 375. It would be great to take the lead off though!!! With that said there is still another .6 seconds in driving to shave off

I think Tyler can make 380.

Let's get everybody out for the double header and aim for 15 karts!!!

[BANZracing]

I'm in....! Lead or no lead....
Brian

[Joey Guyon]

What's my moto weight this weekend? 375?....

[Bainesy36]

If there is a genuine push to level the playing field at the club for stock moto's and ICC's to run competitively together, then it would mean that anyone considering moving into the class could consider both options before buying their shifter. I would also be in the category of being able to make a low weight as I tip the scales at a whopping 145lb! For me, it might push me down that route, as opposed to having to throw 40lbs+ of lead on to run an ICC. (Guessing about weight)

Any thoughts on how to achieve the weight categories? Same driver back to back in stock moto and ICC shifters with different ballast until 2 fair class weights are achieved based on lap times being close to equal? Anyone have a good 'feel' for the difference in lap times at North Star Raceway between the 2? 0.5s, 1s?

Cheers,
Nige.

[Mark]

Perhaps it's just me but it seems like madness to spend for an ICC and then pack on a bunch of lead to slow it down to a moto.

Now.... That being said, I've bought a moto feeling this was a cost-effective, DIY kind of motor and I have watched as people (Nathan, I'm looking at you as an example) have dumped their moto for an ICC to be more competitive.

So.... While we can discuss how much lead we add to the fast guys, it seems to me that the most logical approach is to make "shifter" either a moto class or an ICC class. This is likely to screw me and my investment but I just don't see a practical, sensible compromise.

Personally, I like the concept that shifter is moto. It's affordable and practical. I respect that some have invested considerably on ICC and I don't want to imply that they need to switch back, but we need to pick one and stick with it !

[John Kwong]

I think that the diversity of motors has been one of the things that has allowed the class to grow this year. Tyler running Woolsey's "old" shifter and Joey running a shifter has proven that the moto package is competitive. There are so many more variables with racing a shifter over the single speed karts and when a mistake is made it is amplified much more so. The internal maintenance schedule is much shorter than Rotax and a shifter motor with some time on it is going to be slower. Carb settings are completely open, so all of the internal tubes and jets can be manipulated which can make finding the absolute best settings tricky. I haven't changed my carb settings since 2013 at Varsity Speed Park. The kart runs pretty good but I know there is more there but haven't had the time or energy to test this out. The tight racing we had yesterday at Round 10 was a good example. North Star Raceway is a very demanding track to drive a shifter on.

John K